God Debate in Newsweek
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"Rick Warren is as big as a bear, with a booming voice and easygoing charm. Sam Harris is compact, reserved and, despite the polemical tone of his books, friendly and mild. Warren, one of the best-known pastors in the world, started Saddleback in 1980; now 25,000 people attend the church each Sunday. Harris is softer-spoken; paragraphs pour out of him, complex and fact-filled—as befits a Ph.D. student in neuroscience. At NEWSWEEK's invitation, they met in Warren's office recently and chatted, mostly amiably, for four hours. Jon Meacham moderated."
Here are some excerpts. Here is Meacham's overview.
(HT: Christian Mind)
Here are some excerpts. Here is Meacham's overview.
(HT: Christian Mind)
posted by JT at Sunday, April 01, 2007
9 Comments:
So let me get this straight... you have Sam Harris, a Ph.D in neuroscience debating... a pastor?
What, they couldn't get Os Guiness or N.T. Wright, or Alistair McGrath or someone with a Th.D or Ph.D in religion or something?
I'm sorry, but it looks alot like they were stacking the deck in favor of one side...
Sir, I am insulted by your offensive comment about a minister of the gospel of our LORD Jesus, the Christ. He has been a servant and one of the greatest for this generation. Perhaps you've never read his New York Times Bestseller, Purpose Driven Life, but he has shown he has much more intellectual acumen than most, but at the same time understands the everyday American. Just glance how learned he is: in fact, he even uses no less than thirty versions of our Holy Scripture. It is a shame to see such Anonymous comments used to deface Ministers of our precious and dear LORD. Thankfully, though, there are other opinions than yours.
"I'm betting my life that Jesus was not a liar. When we die, if he's right, I've lost nothing. If I'm right, he's lost everything. I'm not willing to make that gamble." -Rick Warren
This is a terrible conclusion in my way of thinking.
Sounds like Rick doesn't seem to care if there is no Jesus Christ, though it would be nice if there is.
I always get upset when I hear people speak this way. It takes God's truth and makes it optional, or something.
I must also say that Rick Warren said a lot of good stuff. He was even strong in some of his statements, but he leaves you hanging.
I need to hear a little more nailing it down. Preach the Gospel. All the other chatting is good and fine, but preach the Gospel.
"Give me that old time religion!"
Warren bothered me with thsi exchange. What is Warren willing to accept he is wrong about? In this context, it makes it appear to be the virgin birth. He should have been more clear.
HARRIS: It is intellectually dishonest, frankly, to say that you are sure that Jesus was born of a virgin.
WARREN: I say I accept that by faith. And I think it's intellectually dishonest for you to say you have proof that it didn't happen. Here's the difference between you and me. I am open to the possibility that I am wrong in certain areas, and you are not.
Actually, as much as I detest the Purpose Driven drivel, I think Rick Warren did a great job in responding to Harris's blather. I don't think any theologian could have done a better job of it. Warren's way of responding was much better suited for a venue such as that. It wasn't theologically perfect, but I think he was good enough. Kudos to him for a good job.
donsands,
I think Rick, knowingly, is just Americanizing "Pascal's wager." check it out including some commentary on it: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pascal's_Wager
It serves, at the least, as a seed of doubt in the minds and hearts of those who are searching but have not weighed the importance. No argument is good enough for those opposed to God.
This bothers me a little, Rick Warren says: "On the other hand, even if there were no such thing as heaven, I would put my trust in Christ because I have found it a meaningful, satisfactory, significant way to live."
But Paul says in 1 Corinthians 15:19 If in Christ we have hope in this life only, we are of all people most to be pitied.
Clark,
You may surely be right.
I still don't like it. In fact, I believe it can do more harm than good.
Surely if Rick would have said something along the lines of:
"Jesus is my salvation. I can not deny Him. And by His grace I never will.
God forbid that I would boast in anything but the glorious Cross of Christ! I love the risen Lord, and He came and revealed Himself to be God in the flesh to all the world!
He is my life, and I would rather die then deny my loving Savior.
And I pray that His mercy would find your heart, as it did mine."
That would have been better, don't you think.
I do give Rick some credit as well. I said that in my early comment.
He had some strong statements.
But shouldn't the Gospel be something that we breath, and are passionate about.
There's something missing in the Church today.
regarding the first comment. He's Dr. Rick Warren. And I'm sure they left out a lot from the four hour meeting, Rick referred to it as a small piece.
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