Hillary on Abortion
26 comments | PermalinkHT: STRIf you’re a pro-lifer, and if no issue is more important to you than the right of an unborn child to have life, then nothing could be more calamitous than a President Hillary Clinton. I don’t know of any politician who is more uncompromising and extreme on abortion rights than Hillary Clinton. I know this well and don’t state it with anger or hyperbole. Her extremism on abortion rights was the single most shocking, inexplicable find in my research on her faith and politics. I couldn’t understand it. No question. It is truly extraordinary. Nothing, no political issue, impassions her like abortion rights. For Mrs. Clinton, abortion-rights is sacred ground.
By the way, speaking of Catholics, Mother Teresa and Pope John Paul II saw this abortion extremism in Hillary, and both confronted her on it repeatedly, especially Mother Teresa, right up until the day she died. I have a chapter on this in the book. It’s a gripping story.
posted by JT at Friday, October 12, 2007
26 Comments:
A couple of things:
1) Less than one third of Americans oppose Abortion. Source
2) The Clinton/Gore administration of 1992-2000 saw a significant drop in the amount of abortions. Source (figure 1)
3) The amount of people in America who have "no religion" (27.5 million) will overtake Baptists (33.8 million) in the next ten years. Source
Just some facts.
I believe Hilary Clinton is so impassioned about abortion because she herself probably has had an abortion. I personally had an abortion as a teenager before it was even legal. God in His grace and mercy has brought me healing and peace. In reading about the effects of abortion and my experience with other women who have had an abortion, it is not uncommon for a woman to either passionately defend the right and be in denial about the effects on her life or to work in pro-life activities to ammend for her actions. There is, of course, alot more regarding the effects of abortion on a woman's (and men's) lives. But I feel like a received this insight about Hilary Clinton several years ago.
welp... that settles that. Since the majority is okay with abortion, it must be a good thing.
As for Hillary Clinton having an abortion, that would be pure speculation. But it's hard to imagine her needing one.
One Salient Oversight:
Fact #2 implies cause-and-effect rather than correlation.
During the 90s in the US there was a significant increase in state-level pro-life legislation. This was despite, not because of, the Clinton administration. This is much more likely the cause of the decrease in abortions.
For more, see:
http://www.heritage.org/Research/Family/CDA04-01.cfm
JT,
I forwarded the great discussion on Rudy vs. Hillary from yesterday to someone. Her response to me was "why don't they mention Ron Paul?"
So, I'll echo the request you received in another blog. I'm truly ignorant. Will you address Ron Paul?
Thanks!
"I don’t know of any politician who is more uncompromising and extreme on abortion rights"
I think Barak Obama is. Infanticide, where if the aborted baby is still alive, and you simply allow it to die, is endoresed by Obama, but not Clinton, I have heard.
But either Hillary or Barak, or Rudy for that matter, will in no way receive my vote nor support.
JT: You might find the info on this link enlightening. http://www.ontheissues.org/Senate/Hillary_Clinton_Abortion.htm
It's from the horse's mouth. I like it better when Christians go to the source instead of to a longstanding critic of the source. You also might try reading the info posted on her website.
If you've already concluded that what Hillary says and what Hillary will actually do are two very different things, then nevermind.
End of the link:
/Hillary_Clinton_Abortion.htm
I'm still concerned about who to pull the lever for if faced with the Giuliani vs. Clinton scenario.
Evangelical Outpost made a good argument yesterday for how terrible it would be to have a pro-choice Republican president.
That would be a lose-lose scenario.
However, after the past 8 years, I have learned that my hope should be in God, and most definitely not in the Republican party...
One salient oversight,
You are assuming that those who have no religion will overtake Baptists. Who knows what God will do to bring many to Christ using any particular denomination in the next 10 years? That is a rather bold assumption.
From: http://www.ontheissues.org/Rudy_Giuliani.htm
Giuliani on Abortion
* Ultimate decision by woman, her conscience & her doctor. (Aug 2007)
* Allowing choice keeps government out of people's lives. (May 2007)
* Seek bipartisan ways to reduce abortion & increase adoption. (May 2007)
* Giuliani donated to Planned Parenthood throughout 1990s. (May 2007)
* Ok to repeal Roe v. Wade, but ok to view it as precedent too. (May 2007)
* Allow states to fund or not fund abortion. (May 2007)
* Encourage adoptions; ban partial-birth abortion. (May 2007)
* Embryonic stem cell research ok if limited properly. (May 2007)
* FactCheck: Encouraged adoptions; but over-stated results. (May 2007)
* Pro-choice; no ban on partial-birth abortions. (Dec 1999)
Anon,
I posted this in a previous post but to find out who Ron Paul is, got to www.ronpaul2008.com and click the "About" tab. FYI, I will be voting for him and hope I can help convince many others to do the same.
I believe Hilary Clinton is so impassioned about abortion because she herself probably has had an abortion.
Are you serious? Do you have ANY evidence for such an asinine assertion?
Come on... please don't assert things like this. It doesn't add to the conversation.
And yet some people are convinced that a Hillary Clinton presidency would be better in terms of abortion than a presidency of a pro-choice candidate who cares so little about the issue that he's willing to contradict himself and have no coherence to his position, which fits well with his time as a mayor who did almost nothing to promote his officially pro-choice view.
I believe Hilary Clinton is so impassioned about abortion because she herself probably has had an abortion.
Dave, I did not make an assertion. I made a guess based on her radical attitude about abortion rights and statistics of the number of women who have had abortions. I think it's very relavent to discuss why a public political candidate has the views they do. I'm sorry if I offended you.
Hillary leads to more Ruth Bader Ginsburg. No real doubt about that. Rudy G may or may not lead to more RBG. If I have a choice of 100% poison versus maybe poison, maybe not, I believe I will go with the possibility of dodging the poison.
Your theory could be likely, but then again it is complete conjecture.
Based on the statistics, a lot of women out there have had at least one abortion...
From: http://www.guttmacher.org/pubs/fb_induced_abortion.html
In 2002, 1.29 million abortions took place, down from 1.36 million in 1996. From 1973 through 2002, more than 42 million legal abortions occurred.
Each year, two out of every 100 women aged 15–44 have an abortion; 48% of them have had at least one previous abortion.
About half of American women have experienced an unintended pregnancy, and at current rates more than one-third will have had an abortion by age 45.
What is the evangelical position on what should have been done to the 45 million women who murdered their babies between 1973 and today? Just curious.
Justin
You need to clean up this thread of comments, starting with the first couple of libellous anonymous contributions.
I am passionately pro-life in my convictions, but that is no excuse for poisonous slanders passed off as "insights"; and the comment that follows is worse.
This brings no credit to the cause of Christ.
Anonymous I think the "evangelical" opinion or at least mine, for the 45 million women who have had an abortion is grace. I hope that we would be incredibly loving to women who have been part of such a horrible thing. I believe just like Jesus said to the woman in John 8 who had been caught in horrific sexual sin, "neither do I condemn you, go and sin no more." You might not here that from other "evangelicals" but I hope you would hear it from some and understand that Jesus has nothing but grace for those women.
ryan
I guess my question was more along the lines of what happens when you criminalize abortion? Since the evangelical position is that abortion is murder, doesn't the evangelical position mean that 45 million women who are roaming around free should be in prison? I never hear much about this aspect of it. Just wondering what evangelicals who say this is the most important issue of our time do with all these murderers.
anonymous I think I did answer your question. The evangelical position hopefully would not be one of law and condemnation, but grace. I personally do not know any pro-life evangelical who wants to go around locking up all the women who have ever had abortion. Once again this is were grace triumphs over law. Plus we have laws in our country about people being charged for things that were not illegal when they did them.
ryan
hey ryan...
I'm curious how "once again grace triumphs over law"? How have you defined grace in this instance? My understanding of grace is that as believers, we are undeserved recipients of God's grace, poured out upon us when Christ bore the wrath of the Father in our place. In doing so, the law was fulfilled, not overthrown as you implied.
To the first anonymous -
As someone who has never had an abortion but is passionately pro-choice I find your line of reasoning ridiculous. Not everyone who is pro-choice has had an abortion. Part of why I'm pro-choice is the influence of my very republican aunt, who as a nurse saw firsthand the effects of back alley abortions on teenage girls, among others. She is adamantly pro-choice and Catholic and has passed that on to the rest of us. As she's always put it, it's wrong but we believe God is forgiving and wouldn't punish abortion with death or forced hysterectomies (which come hand in hand with illegal abortions - you need only to look at Nicaragua to know thats true). Add to that the fact that the US is not a Christian nation and not everyone agrees on when life begins and you'll see more of the problem with making it illegal.
I think it'd do you some good to realize not everyone believes as you do.
And I'd really like to know how Hillary Clinton's views on abortion are "radical." They seem pretty mainstream to me.
Ryan: If that's the evangelical position, then it makes no sense. It says, on the one hand, that you have murdered an innnocent human being. On the other hand, because that human being was in utero, the consequences of murder are all wiped out. I don't know why a Christian extends "grace" to the murdering mother and not to the other murderers who also premeditate their victims death. Why is the consequence of one premeditated crime less onerous than the other?
On the argument of how God's grace can reach down to the ones who have had abortions and yet the ones who went out and murdered someone should be locked up in prison,,,well, I have view, I'd like to share. God judges sin as sin. No matter if it's a lie or a murder it's all sin to God. Yes, He punishes sin accordingly. He's a God of rightful judgement. The WORLD is who justifies abortion and says murder is different. But then don't you think that the murderer and the one who went through with an abortion both have regrets, one in prison feeling regret and the other at home for the rest of life feeling that same regret. That's because neither one is right, they are both sin. Sin will destroy a person from the inside out. I'm thankful for God's grace that CAN forgive both the intentional murderer and the lady who aborts her baby. The same God forgives a lier, a theif, a fornicater, a person with bad thoughts or communication, and all their other sins if they come to repentance. The sad thing is,,,everyone would rather justify their sins,,,that's where the real problems lie.
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